Thread on Reddit about men wishing they took the MGTOW path (non-MGTOW subreddit)

[airs]

http://www.reddit.com/r/AdviceAnimals/comments/1xz3zm/if_only_it_were_possible_but_i_wont_turn_away/

Here's the image he posted (click the link above to the see the conversion)





Lots of good comments (and lots of "man up and marry or you'll die lonely" or "feel hallow" comments) from men who wish they didn't marry and have kids.. take a read through

[BeijaFlor]

Took a brief look, and yeah, they're running a shame-sammich delicatessen over there. I'm glad to see, though, it's not all about shame sammiches; there are some MGTOW-leaning comments saying that "yeah, the grass IS greener on the single-simple side."

I can get mopey-dopey and sorry-for-myself at times, regretting that I never lived the "Married With Children" life, but never for long. I've got better things to do (haven't we all!)

[Jagrmeister]

This is such a tough discussion for many. I laud the guy who posted this with the Depression Bear and all. The hardest thing in the world to do is admit you took a wrong turn in life. 99% of the time people opt for:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationalization_(making_excuses)
and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-justification

In some ways, divorced men are the ones who can speak the truth about the institution. 99% of the men who are married have found a way to justify the most significant decision they're made in their life and continue to do so for mental sanity. He's learned to see his wife's insistence he always let her know where he is and insistence he not hang out with his buddies Saturday night as "shared sacrifice". He's trained himself to see singledom as lonely instead of the free-wheeling adventure it is. He's stuck and short of breaking up his family- he feels he has to endure it and if so, defend his choices to the bitter end.

You see bits and pieces of insight throughout the thread:

I was ashamed at how relieved I was that I no longer had to come home and then spend the evening running the kids around to various activities and sports practices. And not having to consult someone else about some of my decisions was sweet, too. So much less nagging.

And here I am, 30 and single on a Saturday afternoon, deciding which mountain snowboard down...

--

There are conversational dead-ends. "Grass is greener". Well, sometimes the grass is f*cking greener somewhere else- LOL. I used to live in the Bay Area and the grass there is yellow most of the year. I'm in the Pacific Northwest and the grass is the same deep green all year. There are objective realities and hitting the beach whenever you want and spending your time however you see fit is often better than being dragged to Bed Bath and Beyond.

There is: "You'll die alone". To this, my stock response is:

[jso]

after seeing the disaster areas that my entire family left behind, I have never regretted my decision to be single once.

[airs]

Also the number of comments on that page from men saying they'd live in a small apartment/studio or live a simple life shows how much of the big house/high spending lifestyle is due to women...

[Rouleur]

meh, I still live in a house. I like my space and distance from neighbors. The difference is, instead of being relegated to the garage or basement for my male space, I've made all the bedrooms functional in some way. My whole house is my space.  

[Jagrmeister]

Also the number of comments on that page from men saying they'd live in a small apartment/studio or live a simple life shows how much of the big house/high spending lifestyle is due to women...

Yep. It's the "nesting instinct" + endless badgering & also using the kids as the "reason" she wants a 'big enough' home that make most married men think it's not worth the hassle of pushing back. Result: Suburbia is teeming with McMansions which is money that could probably go into living a better life, or ironically on the things that are important for the kids like getting a college education without going $80K in debt.

[Octavian]

Lets go back to the basic question.Why should a man marry and have a family?

To have a legacy? Wake up and read a newspaper.There is no legacy for anyone to inherit.The men who sent humanity to the moon had reason to feel society offered a legacy for their offspring.The only thing were launching today is record levels of debt .The only thing we can promise kids today is that their standard of living won't be as good as ours, just as much as ours won't be as good in aggregate as our parents were .

Having family around you? Remember Briffauts Law. No association with the male takes place when a female derives no benefit, and it's hard to keep the hamster entertained for thirty minutes, to say nothing of 18 years. With the state granting leadership responsibility for the family unit to the mother, the father will be the last party with someone by their sides when the lights go out.Or worse, the fathers death becomes an eagerly anticipated event by a family of hypergamous, greedy women vying for power and money .There's more honor in hyenas tearing down a dead carcass then that .

Owning a home, raising a family? Those are valued and valid reasons.If the man was in fact in charge of his family. He is in legal and social fact an expendable accessory, with no more social signifigance attached to his presence then the air filter on my car.

Put simply, if there is a logical reason for a man to have a family nowadays, I've yet to encounter it.In all likelihood that's because there isnt one at all.

So that leaves us with the illogical reasons. And the highest one I'd say is social pressure. People are herd like in ways few really want to acknowledge.More to the point, humans have an individual and a collective intolerance for individual success. The best inventors are people who were not held in very high social regard by their peers. A person who forges their own way by nature judges everyone else's way as an inferior path, and even if that's not a conscious judgement made on an individual level, it's the interpretation made by the crowd.....which now would be much, much happier if the maverick would just get down in the weeds and suffer with the rest of them.They'd be just as miserable either way. But at least the crowd would be comfortable in surfing in ignorance.

This is why Galileo faced execution for speaking the truth. This is why going your own way is bucking every social tide in existence. And why so many villify the process even as they long for being able to do that.At one point , after a series of discussion about why I needed no assistance with finding a woman, my friend repeatedly invited unattached women to our events. Being one not to suffer games, I asked my pal what the fuck he thought he was doing.

"Well, man, you just need a female in your life."

I spouted a disposable platitude and left the discussion, but that phrase clicked. How exactly did he come to that determination that I needed a female? Was it statistical analysis of my social life? Was it a logical determination of self happiness?

Neither. It came down to the fact that he was chained to a woman who had his balls in her purse, and he wanted to see me in chains too. The reason he's still my friend is because, frankly, I have no right to judge his psychological foibles.I've got many myself. Back to topic, his entire rationale for trying to fix me up was because he was sick and tired of seeing me free, and it was simply easier to put me in shackles then to remove his own.

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